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	<title>
	Comments on: Low Flow Toilets Causing A Stink	</title>
	<atom:link href="https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/</link>
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	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 24 Apr 2012 17:06:44 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Dan		</title>
		<link>https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/#comment-3971</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Apr 2012 17:06:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calwatchdog.com/?p=13878#comment-3971</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The series Dirty Jobs had an episode where Mike went into the sewers with city workers to repair the aging &quot;brick&quot; sewer lines. Very old and very small lines nowhere near the standard of modern sewer lines. But how do you replace an already inadequate system that runs throughout the busiest and most influential areas of downtown SF without, temporarily at least, making the system worse?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The series Dirty Jobs had an episode where Mike went into the sewers with city workers to repair the aging &#8220;brick&#8221; sewer lines. Very old and very small lines nowhere near the standard of modern sewer lines. But how do you replace an already inadequate system that runs throughout the busiest and most influential areas of downtown SF without, temporarily at least, making the system worse?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Chuck Lambie		</title>
		<link>https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/#comment-3970</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chuck Lambie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Dec 2011 00:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calwatchdog.com/?p=13878#comment-3970</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I wonder what 27 million pounds of bleach will do to the microbes that break down sewage in the digesters? If it kills them, then the city will have to add microbes back into the system so the sewage get treated properly.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder what 27 million pounds of bleach will do to the microbes that break down sewage in the digesters? If it kills them, then the city will have to add microbes back into the system so the sewage get treated properly.</p>
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		<title>
		By: John Koeller		</title>
		<link>https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/#comment-3969</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[John Koeller]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Mar 2011 20:20:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calwatchdog.com/?p=13878#comment-3969</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[All this story does is raise false concerns about toilets when the REAL issue is probably their sewerage infrastructure.  Firstly, ALL sewer lines smell!!  Second, the fact that those odors are escaping tells me that they have some serious problems with the sewer lines (aging, leaking, failing, or ?).  Third, the water efficiency emphasis by SFPUC has been in place for many years and toilets were NOT the only focus.  If there is a lack of water in those sewers and someone has definitively established that the cause is water conservation, then they should examine ALL of the water reduction initiatives undertaken by SFPUC over those many years, not toilets by themselves.  However, in my view, this &#039;stink&#039; has nothing at all to do with water conservation or toilets, but rather with aging sewer infrastructure that needs replacement or repair.

To then extrapolate this situation to other &#039;California cities&#039; by the authors is even more ridiculous.  Clearly, we have media people writing articles that get attention but have no factual basis behind them, because artificial publication deadlines do not allow for any fact-finding (or might it be because these columnists have no understanding whatsoever of technical issues, including infrastructure, engineering, and water demand?)

Really, the ONLY thing that readers should be concerned about is the bleach issue.  Is this merely replacing one odor with another?  And have the impacts really been fully addressed?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All this story does is raise false concerns about toilets when the REAL issue is probably their sewerage infrastructure.  Firstly, ALL sewer lines smell!!  Second, the fact that those odors are escaping tells me that they have some serious problems with the sewer lines (aging, leaking, failing, or ?).  Third, the water efficiency emphasis by SFPUC has been in place for many years and toilets were NOT the only focus.  If there is a lack of water in those sewers and someone has definitively established that the cause is water conservation, then they should examine ALL of the water reduction initiatives undertaken by SFPUC over those many years, not toilets by themselves.  However, in my view, this &#8216;stink&#8217; has nothing at all to do with water conservation or toilets, but rather with aging sewer infrastructure that needs replacement or repair.</p>
<p>To then extrapolate this situation to other &#8216;California cities&#8217; by the authors is even more ridiculous.  Clearly, we have media people writing articles that get attention but have no factual basis behind them, because artificial publication deadlines do not allow for any fact-finding (or might it be because these columnists have no understanding whatsoever of technical issues, including infrastructure, engineering, and water demand?)</p>
<p>Really, the ONLY thing that readers should be concerned about is the bleach issue.  Is this merely replacing one odor with another?  And have the impacts really been fully addressed?</p>
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		<title>
		By: toni little		</title>
		<link>https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/#comment-3968</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[toni little]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Feb 2011 22:31:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calwatchdog.com/?p=13878#comment-3968</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Sad to know some journalists don&#039;t do their homework.  Square 1: Laws are made to impose &quot;best practice&quot; on those who would otherwise disregard &quot;the greater good&quot;.  A lot of good people toiled over the Green Code because the builders you mention could apparently care less about the greater good.  Low-flow and waterless products are better in the long run for water consumption and sewer pipe life, and are a long overdue concept.

San Francisco&#039;s sewage problems could stem from any number of additional factors, including poorly installed toilets, low-flow mechanisms, archaic pipes and engineering. However, pouring millions of pounds of bleach into the bay&#039;s eco-system is just plain ludicrous!  Has the City of San Francisco&#039;s Waste Management considered other more natural means of mitigating the over-populated &quot;output&quot;?  Or, is &quot;out of sight/smell, out of mind&quot; just simple-minded and good enough?

If anything, this situation should be a wake up call to recognize that the time-honored practice of flushing needs to be looked at very seriously and from a whole new perspective - It&#039;s another form of human pollution and it has to be dealt with in a more sustainable manner.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sad to know some journalists don&#8217;t do their homework.  Square 1: Laws are made to impose &#8220;best practice&#8221; on those who would otherwise disregard &#8220;the greater good&#8221;.  A lot of good people toiled over the Green Code because the builders you mention could apparently care less about the greater good.  Low-flow and waterless products are better in the long run for water consumption and sewer pipe life, and are a long overdue concept.</p>
<p>San Francisco&#8217;s sewage problems could stem from any number of additional factors, including poorly installed toilets, low-flow mechanisms, archaic pipes and engineering. However, pouring millions of pounds of bleach into the bay&#8217;s eco-system is just plain ludicrous!  Has the City of San Francisco&#8217;s Waste Management considered other more natural means of mitigating the over-populated &#8220;output&#8221;?  Or, is &#8220;out of sight/smell, out of mind&#8221; just simple-minded and good enough?</p>
<p>If anything, this situation should be a wake up call to recognize that the time-honored practice of flushing needs to be looked at very seriously and from a whole new perspective &#8211; It&#8217;s another form of human pollution and it has to be dealt with in a more sustainable manner.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tweets that mention Low Flow Toilets Causing A Stink &#124; CalWatchDog -- Topsy.com		</title>
		<link>https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/#comment-3967</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tweets that mention Low Flow Toilets Causing A Stink &#124; CalWatchDog -- Topsy.com]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2011 18:37:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calwatchdog.com/?p=13878#comment-3967</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Senator Bob Dutton, Tom Harman. Tom Harman said: All the bleach in the world won’t cover the stench of a bad reg. http://tinyurl.com/4lm9qoq #CARB [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Senator Bob Dutton, Tom Harman. Tom Harman said: All the bleach in the world won’t cover the stench of a bad reg. <a href="http://tinyurl.com/4lm9qoq" rel="nofollow ugc">http://tinyurl.com/4lm9qoq</a> #CARB [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>
		By: Douglas Strother		</title>
		<link>https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/#comment-3966</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Douglas Strother]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2011 04:28:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calwatchdog.com/?p=13878#comment-3966</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Waterless urinals:  porcelain porta-potties.  Extremely nasty!

Go Green...barf.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Waterless urinals:  porcelain porta-potties.  Extremely nasty!</p>
<p>Go Green&#8230;barf.</p>
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		<item>
		<title>
		By: CalWatchdog		</title>
		<link>https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/#comment-3965</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[CalWatchdog]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Feb 2011 19:01:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calwatchdog.com/?p=13878#comment-3965</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Within the building standards document it states, &quot;The enforcing agency may require special inspection to verify compliance with this code or other laws that are enforced by the agency.&quot; Every commercial and residential building is subject to the building codes within the city, county, and state. Each of the state agencies listed receives funding from the penalties assessed, in addition to the fees charged just to begin the project(s), and has a plethora of code inspectors.

This is explained on the Building Standards Commission webpage - the penalties are criminal and civil. http://www.bsc.ca.gov/cd_qustns/cq_faqs.htm#q30

Here is an excerpt: &quot;Additionally, these state laws say that a violation of the state regulations (included building standards) is also a misdemeanor punishable by a monetary fine or imprisonment, or both.

One example is the building standards adopted by the State Fire Marshal and the Department of Housing and Community Development to implement the State Housing Law (SHL) in Health and Safety Code, Division 13, Part 1.5, commencing with Section 17910. Section 17995 establishes a misdemeanor crime for violations of the SHL and the provisions of Title 24 implementing the SHL.&quot;

Here is the building standards webpage:  http://www.bsc.ca.gov/cd_qustns/cq_faqs.htm

- Katy]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Within the building standards document it states, &#8220;The enforcing agency may require special inspection to verify compliance with this code or other laws that are enforced by the agency.&#8221; Every commercial and residential building is subject to the building codes within the city, county, and state. Each of the state agencies listed receives funding from the penalties assessed, in addition to the fees charged just to begin the project(s), and has a plethora of code inspectors.</p>
<p>This is explained on the Building Standards Commission webpage &#8211; the penalties are criminal and civil. <a href="http://www.bsc.ca.gov/cd_qustns/cq_faqs.htm#q30" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.bsc.ca.gov/cd_qustns/cq_faqs.htm#q30</a></p>
<p>Here is an excerpt: &#8220;Additionally, these state laws say that a violation of the state regulations (included building standards) is also a misdemeanor punishable by a monetary fine or imprisonment, or both.</p>
<p>One example is the building standards adopted by the State Fire Marshal and the Department of Housing and Community Development to implement the State Housing Law (SHL) in Health and Safety Code, Division 13, Part 1.5, commencing with Section 17910. Section 17995 establishes a misdemeanor crime for violations of the SHL and the provisions of Title 24 implementing the SHL.&#8221;</p>
<p>Here is the building standards webpage:  <a href="http://www.bsc.ca.gov/cd_qustns/cq_faqs.htm" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.bsc.ca.gov/cd_qustns/cq_faqs.htm</a></p>
<p>&#8211; Katy</p>
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		<title>
		By: David from Oceanside		</title>
		<link>https://calwatchdog.com/2011/02/21/low-flow-toilets-causing-a-stink/#comment-3964</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David from Oceanside]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Feb 2011 17:47:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calwatchdog.com/?p=13878#comment-3964</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Katy,

Besides playing a part in the justification of their existence and meddling, what financial stake does the Department of Housing and Community Development, the Division of State Architect, the Office of the State Fire Marshal, the Office of Statewide Health Planning and Development, the California Energy Commission, and the Building Standards Commission have in this process?

As a side note, I once managed the installation of cell phone equipment in lease space throughout the western US. We would mount antenna on the rooftop and a small cabinet somewhere inside. Of the several hundreds managed, the one we installed at Childrens Hospital took the cake for over design and wasted efforts. All because the Office of the State Architect has jurisdiction. I would guess that hospitals in CA cost 50% or more than they otherwise would due to this state agency.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Katy,</p>
<p>Besides playing a part in the justification of their existence and meddling, what financial stake does the Department of Housing and Community Development, the Division of State Architect, the Office of the State Fire Marshal, the Office of Statewide Health Planning and Development, the California Energy Commission, and the Building Standards Commission have in this process?</p>
<p>As a side note, I once managed the installation of cell phone equipment in lease space throughout the western US. We would mount antenna on the rooftop and a small cabinet somewhere inside. Of the several hundreds managed, the one we installed at Childrens Hospital took the cake for over design and wasted efforts. All because the Office of the State Architect has jurisdiction. I would guess that hospitals in CA cost 50% or more than they otherwise would due to this state agency.</p>
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