‘Everyone is moving out of California’

February 27, 2013 - By admin

Austin City Limit signFeb. 27, 2013

By John Seiler

An old friend I’ve known 46 years called and said, “I was just hearing from a lot of people that everyone is moving out of California. Are you OK?” She lives on the East Coast.

I assured her that things weren’t quite that bad in California. And her statement reminded me of what Yogi Berra once said about a restaurant, “Nobody goes there anymore. It’s too crowded.”

What’s important about my friend’s question is the perception California now has across America: as a place people are leaving. The state does have more out-migration to other states than in-migration; population still is increasing here, slightly, only because of immigration from other countries.

But the real problem is that the perception of California as a failed state will mean fewer young, ambitious people will come here.

As the state with Tinseltown should know, perceptions can be more important than reality. So although California isn’t as bad off as others perceive it, what’s broadcast is an image of failure: of high unemployment, high housing costs, record high state taxes, out-of-control public-employee union power, environmentalist extremism and decades of misgovernance.

Texas Gov. Rick Perry gained national headlines earlier this month trolling in California for jobs and businesses to bring back to Texas. Probably not many businesses were convinced to leave the Golden State for the Lone Star State.

But young business entrepreneurs everywhere might have been influenced. A computer hotshot in Pennsylvania might choose Austin instead of Silicon Valley because in Austin it’s easier to buy a decent-sized home — or any home — and taxes are a lot lower. His salary — say, $150,000 a year — goes a lot farther in Texas.

No one knows about the young hotshot’s choice because he never moved to California in the first place; so he never “left.” But California still has lost a productive worker and taxpayer.

This probably has happened tens of thousands of times, and will happen tens of thousands of times more.

California’s real problem may not be people leaving, but talented people not coming here who in better days would have streamed in.

 

Comments(52)
  1. JKEYES says:

    Can you blame them?

  2. JKEYES says:

    This is why we need to Downsize California.

  3. Tkg2902 says:

    Its going to worse before it gets better. Sacramento is obstinately dedicated to driving this beautiful state to the poorhouse in a Rolls Royce.

  4. Tririder says:

    Ca. Has gone beyond the point of no return. It will begin to resemble a third world country in the near future. It’s a shame, it is a beautiful place geographically. Thank you liberal politicians.

  5. Dan says:

    Come on, it’s not “immigration” from other countries, it is illegal entry from other countries.

  6. Barb says:

    I just checked out the rates at the U-Haul site to see how much it would cost to rent a 20′ truck from SoCal to Dallas and viceee versaaa. Here is the breakdown:

    Dallas ——–>SoCal $1058
    SoCal ———>Dallas $2222

    It cost twice as much to move to Tejas! This is not a perception! Apparently, the demand to move out of California is great and U-Haul, being good capitalist, are taking advantage of it!

    There’s a good book titled, “How money walks” by Travis Brown which discusses how states are now competing for dollars as a result of tax policies in individual states.

    “The book compiles data from the IRS detailing how Adjusted Gross Income (AGI) moves based on tax policies on a county-by-county basis all across the country. State income tax rates vary pretty wildly, and places like Texas and Florida and, more recently, Kansas, are benefitting from individuals moving themselves and their AGI to places with lower tax liability,” Brown said. This book tracks from 1995 to 2010 and shows how people in say, Saint Louis County, have moved millions of dollars of AGI to Dallas County, Texas.”

    See more at: http://themissouritimes.com/260/travis-brown-authors-book-how-money-walks/#sthash.fhrQpURm.dpuf

  7. Joshua Gibson says:

    I work for a specialty tax consulting firm that handles business incentives and corporate taxation that’s based in Sacramento. I can tell you first hand that there is an exodus occurring that is made of up of established and fledgling businesses, and it’s been in the works for a long time.

    There were businesses that were going to wait to take advantage of our services to see what the results of the elections. When Prop 30 passed and Obama got reelected there were businesses that thanked me for my time, and proceeded to shutter CA ops, and relocate to UT, and GA, but the majority headed to Texas.

  8. SeeSaw says:

    And, of course, Mr. Seiler, you are not participating in promoting that negative perception of CA! Oh, No!

  9. jimmydeeoc says:

    Bad John ! Very, very bad John! You are not spinning a chamber of commerce twist!

    apparently this is “bad reporting”, according to our own emily litella. lol lol…..

    Seesaw….providing heaps o’ laffs, every day……..

  10. Paul says:

    Because Kommiefornia is turning into a 3rd world shit hole…

  11. Rye says:

    I cant believe anyones really surprised by this. But…there will be 3 more leaving on the 1st of april. My buisness re-opens in San Antonio the following week. My wife & I have decided that it was a mistake to move here from Colorado & we simply cant run the buisness in a state that gouges us at every opportunity. Oh well….sa-la-vi.

  12. doug says:

    perceived?
    we know about the state parks “misplacing” 50+ million yet asking for more in a proposition. high speed rail with no private investors, LAUSD in hot water with bad teachers, low test scores and yet a new tax to pay for our kids future.
    3 cities filed for bankruptcy, pension-held cities cant pay their cops and firefighters. i just saw a new ad for measure A asking for more money for these guys. i personally know 4 people who have left our state due to high cost of living.
    the ground work is being paved right now with facts.
    we have the highest taxes in the country and the largest unions right here!

  13. Debbie says:

    As a high school teacher, I see a lot of my students moving out of state. Have one leaving tomorrow for Missouri, and several have gone to Texas with their families because they can do better than in California. And me? When I retired you better believe I won’t be in California!!

  14. Hondo says:

    As I’ve said all along, money moves a lot easier than people. People can be tied down by family or mortgages or customers. An accountant in Semi valley has built up his customer base over the years. Moving to Texas garauntees nothing. All his customers are back in Kali. And his kids are in school and have best friends and his family may be in Kali.
    New California collage graduates have no such roots. I’m sure many are leaving the state that educated them and are going to a state that will employ them. Investment money has no such roots either. Smart money from Kalifornia may be invested in Florida or Texas rather than at home. Money from outside the state will most likely be spent in a lower taxed, lower regulated state.
    If there is an exodus of people from Kali, its from the kids it educated, headed for a job in another state.
    Hondo…..

  15. SkippingDog says:

    Texas salaries aren’t as high as those in California, even for people in high technology jobs. Add to that the fact that Texas has one of the highest percentages of people living in poverty, spends among the least of all states on education and training, and will be a purple or blue state in the fairly near future due to demographic shift, it’s hard to understand why you libertarians think it’s some kind of utopia.

    On top of all that, when you wake up each day you’re still stuck in Texas.

  16. nraendowment says:

    What Dan said.

  17. John Reagan says:

    I spent 2 years in Texas; Austin, Houston and Corpus Christi. This State runs on fraud and back room deals. Culture is something they think you find in a petri dish. Attitudes towards women are particularly odd compared to any other State I’ve lived in. And if you wonder how anyone could elect mental midgets like Bush Jr and Rick Perry, it’s because they represent the common intellect of Texas. Any business that packs up and heads to Texas should seriously research the reality of what they’re getting into. I couldn’t wait to get back to California. This in not meant to be trolling for an argument, just a serious appraisal of Texas based on my experiences there.

  18. Hondo says:

    SkippingDog:
    By your reckoning, Kalifornia is the greatest place in the world to be unemployed. SkippingDog, the greatest social program is a JOB.
    Hondo..

  19. SkippingDog says:

    A job is certainly the most desirable circumstance, Hondo, but you didn’t explain why such a large percentage of Texans are living in poverty, even if they have a job there.

    You also didn’t explain why or how people moving to Texas are going to be more competitive as workers in a place where basic things like education and infrastructure investment are largely ignored.

    The petroleum industry is one of the largest drivers of the Texas economy, along with federal military spending. There are only so many “good jobs” available in the petroleum industry for untrained people with a strong back, so the lack of education or training will not do a single thing for people who aren’t able to be roustabouts on a rig or in a refinery.

  20. brad says:

    skipper there were lots of poverty in California just as well. 60% of school kids qualify for free lunches. There is poverty in all the states. Texas does not have the best unemployment rate either. Even Hawaii has a lower unemployment rate then Texas. I didnt choose Texas to move to, but couldnt take CA anymore after 35 years and moved to where I could enjoy life, have the freedoms and money to do things without the stress of crowded freeways, high taxes and cost of living. Sorry but no thanks, Ca is only a place to visit now.

  21. VW says:

    All this Cali-bashing spurned me to action because I am still loyal to the state I’ve lived in since I was six. I’m sure what I’ll describe can be found in numerous other states, but I want to present at least one positive version of “real” life in Cali, with as little falsehoods or political coloring.

    A day in the life in early Spring (or summer, fall, winter): I wake at 6:15 am to the sound of birds. I draw open the curtains and the San Gabriels in the early sunlight. It’s a mild 58 degrees.

    By 7am I am at work near downtown LA, a 20 minute, 12-mile commute. I run a manufacturing firm which has been headquarted in the same location since 1949. Most of our employees have been with us over 15 years, turnover is low, and loyalty is high. I quickly yell out hello to some employees: a Mexican-, a Chinese-, a Philippine-, and a Czech-American.
    I spend the day talking to people from all over the country and world, and when talk turns personal, the first question is usually, “what’s the weather like in Los Angeles? Mine is terrible.”

    I leave around 5pm and return to my house, a historic arts and craft cottage with four 100-year old oaks. A few neighbors greet me (one is a gay pastor of an Episcopalian Church), the other a widow of a well-known Broadway playwright.

    Many of the flowers are in full bloom, purple lavenders, white cistus, yellow daffodils, magenta valerian, and roses in a multitude of colors.

    I go for a hike in the local mountains, and after 20 minutes, I can see the ocean in the distance. My friend calls me and says she’s leaving for her cabin in the woods where there’s still snow. And a surfer friend posts on Facebook that he’s going to catch the last waves of the day.

    Later I grab dinner, and decide between Thai, Chinese, Mexican, organic vegetarian, or Greek. But I’m not dressed for a four-star meal, so I get away with a $15 tab at the local Lebanese place which is equally as good.

    The moon is full on my drive home and I can see a few constellations. As I wind down in my backyard with a glass of wine, all I hear is the breeze rustling the oaks.

    And no, I’m not living the charmed life because I don’t make high six-figures nor do I live in a gated community or any such nonsense. I’m a middle-class, businesswoman living in an urban neighborhood who is still optimistic that CA has something to offer.

  22. Mike Machiaverna says:

    I do agree, Cali is a beautiful place geographically speaking and the lifestyle that can be enjoyed is second to none for now, but the future of the state is in question and for good reason. Without a sound fiscal policy or direction the state will stumble, not to mention our educational system. The question is, will it fall?

  23. Mandeep says:

    I’m interested in everyone’s opinion, whether positive or otherwise.

    I’m looking to live in CA for a short period, say, perhaps a year or two. I’m not interested in making money (although it’d be nice), I just want to earn a decent enough wage to get by on. I don’t want to get involved in politics, I’ve seen enough from my experience in international humanitarian work. I just want to live a healthy lifestyle in a beautiful sunny State.

    What do you think, Californians, is it possible?

  24. pete says:

    Mandeep

    If you can get yourself qualified for for the free social services given to the freeloaders it a great place to live. I’m not talking about those truly in need!
    Don’t plan on assistance in starting a business as California is the worst place in the USA for business.
    If you are fortunate enough to make a decent living the State will take 13% to give to the ever growing number of freeloader and so called Public Servants”.
    If I were you I’d look at Texas?

  25. Kelly says:

    My family is on our way out. 2 master’s degrees, and 22 years experience, making 90k a year. In Orange County, 90k should be well below the poverty line. With the increased taxes in Jan ’13 now we don’t get ahead at all anymore, and have decided to move.

    Was born in Texas, raised in Texas, and from what I’ve seen since I’ve been here they can keep California for the rich. Me? I’m going somewhere that a gallon of milk costs less than a gallon of gas.

    P.S. Might want to check your figures up there, Texas doesn’t have state tax.

  26. Larry says:

    I moved out of California after living there 56 years.. I sold my home and moved to Idaho Sept., 2011. Biggest mistake I have EVER made in my life and have been trying to get back ever since. The climate, places to go within driving distance, etc. etc. etc. make California the BEST place on earth to live. Cant wait to get back home!!! Don’t ever assume that the ‘grass is always greener on the other side”.

    • Angela says:

      I did the same thing in June 2013…came to Florida …hell hole ….can’t wait to get back to Cali selling my home and moving back already reserved truck for summer ..

      • GiovanniTheGreat says:

        People from CA only cant wait to return to CA.. outsiders like myself move to CA and want to run when the chance is right and never ever return. CA sucks.. FL is much better.

  27. Dee Cas says:

    I live in Staten Island NY., I hear that NY is like Cali, feel like I need a change at age 57., what is a good place for a single woman at my age to possibly meet new friends and not go broke? I’d be retired. Cali sounds beautiful though, but expensive like NY, and alot of freeloaders in both Cali and NY,,,not good. I agree with Larry about having places to go within driving distance., I’m not one for the suburbs…

  28. connie s says:

    I can’t wait to leave California, lived here when I was younger, left, came back for a job…..big mistake! The reasons I left in the 80’s is still true today.
    To many illegals, people are not friendly, as a matter of fact they are some of the rudest. If you happen to make eye contact with someone and they smile and say hello THEN you just encountered a person from another state. Californians don’t feel it’s necessary to talk or even get to know their neighbors, people in thier communities etc. Pretty soon ca. will be like a 3rd world country, almost is. Go to grocery store, you hear more Spanish then what I thought was our national language ENGLISH. Olay rich areas have it a bit better. If you want friendly people, sense of community and decent place to raise children THEN run don’t walk away from California. It’s not available there.

    • GiovanniTheGreat says:

      Small towns like Auburn are even turning into havens for rude people as well and this comes from a MA person. CA is not fit, especially Northern for anyone out of state. I feel much more at home in Florida and cant wait to return. So yea suck it Bay Area people!

  29. ultra says:

    Don’t move to Austin please. And stop buying up our land with your inflated salaries. Work to make California less depressing. Please stay away; we can’t handle the growth here.

    • I_AM_ME says:

      I like that comment ultra. We Californians needs to make it better and not just run away. WE need to stand together and get the government to hear us! And immigration is a MAJOR issue in California at this time. It needs to be controlled better than what CALIFORNIA is doing now.

  30. Leonard says:

    California is a horrible place to live, we are taxed on EVERYTHING, so when the working poor can longer afford to survive, and more of the middle class has moved away, who is going to pay for Jerry’s train? who is going ride it for that matter… SO what is going to happen when the tax dollars that you are expected to pay, no longer reach the levels needed to fund the lunacy of special interest influenced laws? I can tell you, if your from California you know the city, Stockton, for those of you from elsewhere remember Detroit, that will be CA, dominated by leftist liberals, just like Detroit and just like Stockton… Do you think the federal government will bail out CA? The answer is no, sure they can raise taxes, again, but the level they will need to raise to will cause a new civil war… This is happening all over the world right now, Greece is a good example, poor there are starving the in streets, I just hope I am alive when it happens, not for the ‘I told you so’, but just to watch all of you victimized people run around defenseless begging the liberal government to give you more handouts at the FEMA/DHS camps that you live and die in. I will never vote for another dirty, lying, self absorbed democrat again. Do yourself a favor, and never vote for the democrats again!

  31. Nick says:

    I lived in Ohio for most of my life than moved to South Central California for a few years and gladly moved back to Ohio soon after. What has been mentioned earlier were some of the main reasons, i.e. the people aren’t very nice (say hello to someone walking on the sidewalk and they look and don’t say a word back), the weather (while it was typically nice, I grew up with season the seasons actually change and not have everyday look similiar, so it was a preference issue), the immigrants (it amazes me how many people didn’t speak any English. And not just new immigrants, but those who have been here for 30 years yet make no attempt to learn English), the education system (Kern County was beyond corrupt and the student results were depressing, the worst school system I have ever witnessed).

    I just couldn’t imagine raising my family with the type of public school systems found in Central Cali. I’ve spent a lot of time in both LA and NYC and when asked the difference I simply state that I’d return to NYC with a smile any day of the week but I’d never, ever, want to return to LA! My wife is from San Diego, born and raised, and even prefers lovely Ohio to Cali!

    • Jay says:

      Wow, now that is BAD! That is a HUGE statement in my opinion; preferring OHIO over California? I never been to California but I made the awful mistake of moving to Ohio for my job and it has been miserable. I have been to many states and I must say that without a doubt, Ohio is by far the worst. I don’t know why ANYONE would want to live here. Awful, awful state.

  32. toldyaso says:

    It’s not like any number of people didn’t warn you of this. But you bought the easy way out with progressive lies. No, you come to texas and in 30 years we’ll be in the same boat. I can see it in Austin and Houston already. Keep yourself in California and fix it there. You people are like roaches. The problem isn’t California. It’s YOU. We in Texas enjoy success because of our conservative principles. When you outnumber us, we’ll end up just like you and then move again. Just look at history and there’s the only proof I need. I won’t need to argue with anyone here because time will prove me right. Texans will fight to keep what is traditionally “Texas”. You have no idea what it means to be a Texan because you tuck tail and run.

  33. smitty says:

    Good, all of you conservaturds can get the fuck out and overpopulate Texas. You aren’t wanted here, fuck off so we can get back to work making this state great again.

    And take the Crystal Cathedral with you.

  34. vuyp says:

    I have lived in a few different states. I surprisingly also prefer Ohio over California, by a land slide!

    • Jay says:

      Unbelievable! This is starting to really scare me because I was considering relocating to California. But these Ohio to Cali preferences are very strong statements Californians. I would find it extremely insulting if it were my home state.

  35. Alan Wasner says:

    One place that many people over-look is the Coast of Oregon. Near Newport, which has excellent medical and other services including modern grocery stores, are small communities such as Otter Rock that are often over-looked. They’re wonderful places with essentially NO CRIME. In the 10 years I lived in Otter Rock there was ZERO reported crime. But online there aren’t statistics kept for some of these smaller towns. On the coast of Oregon you have to like weather and many people come there to storm watch, but the good thing is the storms don’t linger, they blow through. Often in the same day as a large storm we get sunshine in the afternoon, unlike Portland where it stays socked in for days. It’s a wonderful place with friendly people. No sales taxes, great benefits for Veterans with the State, and it’s not an over-developed nightmare.

  36. Harry says:

    California is Beautiful. I am a fourth gen Californian here in the Bay Area, but as soon as my daughter is off to college I am out of this liberal progressive hell hole. Not for good. I own too much rental properties for that, but I LOVE gouging the liberals every month. Liberal scum aside, it is not that bad, but the taxes to pay for the losers like smitty. The thought of living in Texas with those inbreed idiots is just as bad as the liberaltards in California. I am looking at Arizona.

  37. Larry Miller says:

    The invention of the microchip torpedoed California as the greatest state on earth. Corporations redefined the word greed to include; A. Outsourcing 90% of jobs to 3rd world countries to fatten CEO salaries and emoluments B started requiring long time loyal employees to clean out their desks by Friday C So they could be replaced by computers. D Then desk top jockeys started being downsized in favor of illegals who were encouraged to come into the state to “game the system”. E Those left were told learn Spanish fluently or get the [...] out. F. Now you know why California is a [...]. Don’t blame the liberals, the ACLU or other giveaway artists. Blame greedy f’n employers who would not hesitate to sell out their own grandmothers for 30 pieces of silver. Been there, seen that, done that.

  38. Undisclosed says:

    Is it worth moving to Sunnyvale, CA with a salary package of 140k per year for an IT professional?
    Will I be able to save anything?

  39. Cali says:

    Yes. You will be. If you have family and kids then it’s different.

  40. American says:

    California going down as poor criminal immigrants and their gangs and cartels move in. State debt rising. Cities declaring bankruptcy. Used to be a golden state. Now it’s just a proxy of Tijuana.

  41. GiovanniTheGreat says:

    I came to Sacramento area due to a new family situation that happened with my moms 3rd marriage. Ever since I got to the area, I’ve had trouble adjusting, moved to CA 3 times over 3 yrs due to some other escapes I tried to make and this isn’t even L.A. In fact sometimes I wonder if I’d be better off in L.A because at the very least theres so many more people to pick from and more transplants move there. Native Californians suck for the most part I won’t lie. Unless you’re in some nice urban part of Sacramento like East Sac or Fab 40s, it won’t feel as community oriented and as “cute”.
    I am originally from MA, lived in FL for 7 yrs and there, its all about neighborhood. If you don’t like a neighborhood you’re in, move to another and problem will be solved. In CA, you’re in one hellhole, you go to another. Any place is sprawl written and its all the same for the most part. Theres not as much diversity as you’d think. FL has a lot more diversity than CA.. YES I SAID IT. A lot more even with ethnicities also but I am also talking about diversity as far as vibe, traffic vs non traffic, coastal vs non coastal, older retirement complexes, transplanted resident neighborhoods, rednecks, more young people than most states.. South FL is the true melting pot, NOT California or Texas. Some parts of South FL are like Southern California just with less aggravation. But oh no, I am so sorry I told you all this now. California is a joke ,its overrated, full of wildfires and is going bankrupt. I will take floods and hurricanes anyday over dryness.

  42. roni baxter says:

    Left Cali 12 yes ago for Arizona. When I go back it is a 3rd world country. Traffic and people are insane.

  43. Alyssa from Alabama says:

    I recently moved here from Alabama. To my surprise my neighboring city has declared bankruptcy. The education system here does in no way compare to the education system in Huntsville, AL. Most native Californians are not all that bright. I moved out here for grad school. I like the weather, the outdoor life, and the big city. However, after graduating there is no way I can afford to live in this state. Most of the affordable cities are ghetto or filled with Hispanics. The nicer cities are too much out of my price range. Looks like I’ll be moving back to AL when I’m done.

Archive By Categories
  • California economy
  • Corruption
  • Demographics
  • Education
  • Fracking
  • Health Care
  • Income inequality
  • Infrastructure
  • Inside Government
  • Law enforcement
  • Media
  • Obamacare
  • Obamacare implementation
  • Pension Reform
  • Politics and Elections
  • Regulations
  • Rights and Liberties
  • Seen at the Capitol
  • Taxes
  • Technology
  • Thought police
  • Thoughtcrime
  • Waste, Fraud and Abuse